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some random thoughts about body image
I just posted all this on tumblr but I'm putting it here too because this functions much more as my journal so I like to keep thoughts like this archived here. It contains a lot of body image talk, so feel free to skip if you're not interested or if that could trigger you in any way. I'm putting it here for me, but you're welcome to talk if you wish. Whatever works for you!
I really really hate shopping a lot.
I used to be so thin and toothpick-shaped that I could basically wear anything. And I grew up wearing hand-me-downs and not caring about clothes almost at all (there was a year or two during middle school when I wore overalls almost every day—in various colors, even). In college I figured out that I actually liked clothes (if not fashion) and that I REALLY liked dresses.
But then after college my body actually shifted. I’ve always had no shoulders to speak of and a very flat chest. But now I have very wide hips. But thin legs. (And a belly—it’s the only place I gain weight. No weight I gain goes to my chest or even my legs, only my belly. Whatever.) Most of the time I don’t care about what my body looks like: it’s here just to get me from one place to another. But when I’m shopping? It’s hard.
Because I can’t find dresses that look good on me anymore, except for very structured ones that are usually pretty heavy fabric and dressy. So I have a few dresses to wear to work that I look quite nice in. But I want casual dresses to run around town in and to wear when I go out…and none of them look good on me anymore. And finding pants that fit is SO HARD because my legs are so thin but my hips are so wide that by the time I find things that will zip up at the waist they are way baggy on my legs. I can find shirts that look nice, sometimes, though having no shoulders and no chest to fill them out makes that more difficult. It’s just really, really hard to find clothes. (And my sister looks good in everything because she’s so average-weight and proportional.)
I don’t hate my body. The only time I have angst over it is when I go shopping because clothes seem to be made for just one or two body types and if you aren’t that body type, tough. BUT THERE ARE SO MANY DIFFERENT BODY TYPES OUT THERE. I wish everything was made bespoke or something because that way you could suit everything directly to your body. And I sometimes feel bad complaining because I do manage to find enough clothes I don’t hate and also I know how much harder it is if you’re plus-size because the plus-size selection sucks even more than the regular selection.
It’s just terrible walking into the department store and there are thousands and thousands of garments and I don’t like most of them and the ones I do like don’t look right on my body. Add to that just all the people and the exhaustion of lugging things around and putting on clothes and taking them off again, and I haaaaaaaate clothes shopping. Ugh.
I’ve been thinking about that little monologue from Pulp Fiction where Bruce Willis’ French girlfriend (I think she’s French? I’ve only seen it once and it was yeeeeaaars ago) talks about the difference between what we find aesthetically pleasing and what we enjoy tactically—about how pot bellies are lovely to touch but we act like they’re the opposite of sexy. And it’s true—people who are soft, who have a lot of ‘padding’ can be really, really lovely to hug (not that thinner or more muscular people aren’t, but I particularly like hugging someone soft) and touch. But we have defined beauty so narrowly that women are only allowed to have curves in two places (butts and boobs, basically) and everywhere else is supposed to be flat and toned, even though that’s quite a hard thing for most people to attain. It’s so frustrating.
One thing I’ve liked about being in kpop fandom is that female desire is really celebrated (this is going to tie back in, I promise) and that we can talk about small aspects of our favorite idols bodies and how we appreciate them and no one thinks it’s strange. So I can talk about how I love Sungyeol’s untoned belly and how adorable it is and everything and no one thinks that’s strange. I hear a lot of people talking about Sunggyu’s meaty arms and being pleased when he gains weight. I talk with great frequency about loving Sungyeol’s completely flat ass.
And I don’t see that happen much outside of kpop fandom! But it’s cool to celebrate things that are usually ignored or portrayed as negative physically. I just wish we did it more with female idols because it’s just as true about ladies! Celebrating the male idols’ ‘imperfections’ and all the things we’re attracted to that aren’t typically portrayed as attractive is AWESOME. But we need to do a much better job about doing the same with ladies, especially ourselves.
I do really love the way that my belly feels. When I’m alone, I don’t mind how it looks, either. I think it’s soft and lovely and after years of being mostly just skin and bone, finding that softness in my body is nice. It’s only when I interact with other people—mostly when I think about how people will look at me in the clothes I pick out—that I end up disliking it. It’s ENTIRELY about other people’s opinions and that’s sad. I don’t want to internalize that and yet I do. I’m already sensitive to others’ opinions because of my social anxiety. Add to that how harshly we judge each others’ opinions and it’s no wonder I end up judging myself for how I look. I want to figure out a way not to do that.
I also had an issue today at the mall because it felt like every young woman—teens, 20s—that I saw looked exactly the same: white (this mall is in a nicer area of town and there ARE people of color there, but not nearly as many and of course that’s hugely problematic), looong very straight hair, makeup but not ‘too much,’ femme but not really girly. And I don’t fit that besides the white thing. My hair is just past my chin and very curly. I don’t wear makeup almost at all (today I had a bit of lipstick on because my lips have been chapped). I feel like I stand out completely and it makes me feel self-conscious. And I’m a young average-weight white femme woman! I can’t imagine how much harder it is if you’re butch or a woman of color or plus-sized.
My mother sheltered my sister and me from negative media images of women. She didn’t have women’s magazines in the house, we watched VERY little TV that wasn’t on PBS, she never talked about her weight—she basically created this world where we felt pretty but that our prettiness wasn’t the most important thing about us and where we didn’t feel like we had to compare ourselves to other women. And because of that I have a much better self image than most women, as well as a healthier relationship with food (food was NEVER a moral thing, ever). I’m amazed that she did that with us, especially now that I know that she has a lot of self-image problems and struggles with her weight and her relationship to food. I’m so grateful to her for how she protected us.
But I guess because of this I never realized just how narrow the portrayals of appropriate/desirable women are in the media. I was reading books about brainy girls (and yes, they were mostly—though certainly not all—white and straight and cis and everything and I realize that’s a HUUUUUGE problem, but they were still not being judged by their looks but by their character and minds and actions, which is a step up from common media portrayals) and managed to miss it. So now it’s suddenly smacking me in the face and I’m kind of reeling from it and I don’t like it and I want other portrayals of women SO BADLY and I want to go back to having the sort of relationship with my body that was much more positive, but I’m not sure how to do all that.
Anyway. This is some extreme navel(heh)-gazing—sorry about that. Just some random thoughts I’ve been having.
I really really hate shopping a lot.
I used to be so thin and toothpick-shaped that I could basically wear anything. And I grew up wearing hand-me-downs and not caring about clothes almost at all (there was a year or two during middle school when I wore overalls almost every day—in various colors, even). In college I figured out that I actually liked clothes (if not fashion) and that I REALLY liked dresses.
But then after college my body actually shifted. I’ve always had no shoulders to speak of and a very flat chest. But now I have very wide hips. But thin legs. (And a belly—it’s the only place I gain weight. No weight I gain goes to my chest or even my legs, only my belly. Whatever.) Most of the time I don’t care about what my body looks like: it’s here just to get me from one place to another. But when I’m shopping? It’s hard.
Because I can’t find dresses that look good on me anymore, except for very structured ones that are usually pretty heavy fabric and dressy. So I have a few dresses to wear to work that I look quite nice in. But I want casual dresses to run around town in and to wear when I go out…and none of them look good on me anymore. And finding pants that fit is SO HARD because my legs are so thin but my hips are so wide that by the time I find things that will zip up at the waist they are way baggy on my legs. I can find shirts that look nice, sometimes, though having no shoulders and no chest to fill them out makes that more difficult. It’s just really, really hard to find clothes. (And my sister looks good in everything because she’s so average-weight and proportional.)
I don’t hate my body. The only time I have angst over it is when I go shopping because clothes seem to be made for just one or two body types and if you aren’t that body type, tough. BUT THERE ARE SO MANY DIFFERENT BODY TYPES OUT THERE. I wish everything was made bespoke or something because that way you could suit everything directly to your body. And I sometimes feel bad complaining because I do manage to find enough clothes I don’t hate and also I know how much harder it is if you’re plus-size because the plus-size selection sucks even more than the regular selection.
It’s just terrible walking into the department store and there are thousands and thousands of garments and I don’t like most of them and the ones I do like don’t look right on my body. Add to that just all the people and the exhaustion of lugging things around and putting on clothes and taking them off again, and I haaaaaaaate clothes shopping. Ugh.
I’ve been thinking about that little monologue from Pulp Fiction where Bruce Willis’ French girlfriend (I think she’s French? I’ve only seen it once and it was yeeeeaaars ago) talks about the difference between what we find aesthetically pleasing and what we enjoy tactically—about how pot bellies are lovely to touch but we act like they’re the opposite of sexy. And it’s true—people who are soft, who have a lot of ‘padding’ can be really, really lovely to hug (not that thinner or more muscular people aren’t, but I particularly like hugging someone soft) and touch. But we have defined beauty so narrowly that women are only allowed to have curves in two places (butts and boobs, basically) and everywhere else is supposed to be flat and toned, even though that’s quite a hard thing for most people to attain. It’s so frustrating.
One thing I’ve liked about being in kpop fandom is that female desire is really celebrated (this is going to tie back in, I promise) and that we can talk about small aspects of our favorite idols bodies and how we appreciate them and no one thinks it’s strange. So I can talk about how I love Sungyeol’s untoned belly and how adorable it is and everything and no one thinks that’s strange. I hear a lot of people talking about Sunggyu’s meaty arms and being pleased when he gains weight. I talk with great frequency about loving Sungyeol’s completely flat ass.
And I don’t see that happen much outside of kpop fandom! But it’s cool to celebrate things that are usually ignored or portrayed as negative physically. I just wish we did it more with female idols because it’s just as true about ladies! Celebrating the male idols’ ‘imperfections’ and all the things we’re attracted to that aren’t typically portrayed as attractive is AWESOME. But we need to do a much better job about doing the same with ladies, especially ourselves.
I do really love the way that my belly feels. When I’m alone, I don’t mind how it looks, either. I think it’s soft and lovely and after years of being mostly just skin and bone, finding that softness in my body is nice. It’s only when I interact with other people—mostly when I think about how people will look at me in the clothes I pick out—that I end up disliking it. It’s ENTIRELY about other people’s opinions and that’s sad. I don’t want to internalize that and yet I do. I’m already sensitive to others’ opinions because of my social anxiety. Add to that how harshly we judge each others’ opinions and it’s no wonder I end up judging myself for how I look. I want to figure out a way not to do that.
I also had an issue today at the mall because it felt like every young woman—teens, 20s—that I saw looked exactly the same: white (this mall is in a nicer area of town and there ARE people of color there, but not nearly as many and of course that’s hugely problematic), looong very straight hair, makeup but not ‘too much,’ femme but not really girly. And I don’t fit that besides the white thing. My hair is just past my chin and very curly. I don’t wear makeup almost at all (today I had a bit of lipstick on because my lips have been chapped). I feel like I stand out completely and it makes me feel self-conscious. And I’m a young average-weight white femme woman! I can’t imagine how much harder it is if you’re butch or a woman of color or plus-sized.
My mother sheltered my sister and me from negative media images of women. She didn’t have women’s magazines in the house, we watched VERY little TV that wasn’t on PBS, she never talked about her weight—she basically created this world where we felt pretty but that our prettiness wasn’t the most important thing about us and where we didn’t feel like we had to compare ourselves to other women. And because of that I have a much better self image than most women, as well as a healthier relationship with food (food was NEVER a moral thing, ever). I’m amazed that she did that with us, especially now that I know that she has a lot of self-image problems and struggles with her weight and her relationship to food. I’m so grateful to her for how she protected us.
But I guess because of this I never realized just how narrow the portrayals of appropriate/desirable women are in the media. I was reading books about brainy girls (and yes, they were mostly—though certainly not all—white and straight and cis and everything and I realize that’s a HUUUUUGE problem, but they were still not being judged by their looks but by their character and minds and actions, which is a step up from common media portrayals) and managed to miss it. So now it’s suddenly smacking me in the face and I’m kind of reeling from it and I don’t like it and I want other portrayals of women SO BADLY and I want to go back to having the sort of relationship with my body that was much more positive, but I’m not sure how to do all that.
Anyway. This is some extreme navel(heh)-gazing—sorry about that. Just some random thoughts I’ve been having.
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What's most infuriating for me is that I KNOW that in right clothes, I'd look amazing. I'm a huge hourglass, big boobs and wide hips with relatively narrow waist. I can look good. But the clothes are freakishly hard to get (once upon a time it took me a month to hunt down a button-down), they're less comfortable, more bothersome -- so most of the days, it's just jeans and t-shirt. Not flattering at all.
Sorry, I'm rambling. Body image is one of my biggest issues, and I'm trying very hard not to end up giving you five comments' worth of rant.
You might want to read Atwood's "Lady Oracle". It's not an optimistic novel, but an amazing study of how body image issues are made.
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I wish you good luck in finding clothes you love.
(You can always give me five comments' worths of rants, if you ever want to. Though that's time-consuming, so I don't blame you for not wanting to!)
I haven't read that one, but that one line has sold me on it. I didn't know what that one is about but now I definitely want to read it. Thank you!
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The scariest thing is that no matter how my body changes, my body image doesn't change. I feel the same all the time. I can tell, looking at pictures and clothes, that I'm fatter than I was when I was 16, but thinner than when I was 24. But it feels like my body's been identical for the last 10 years. I'm overweight now, but I recognize that I was just average when I was a teenager -- and yet I was convinced I was terribly fat.
Sorry, this is incoherent and awfully self-centered. I literally have no idea how to talk about this without talking about myself all the time. I take body image very personally.
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I'm smart, I know how those mechanisms work, I should know better! Watch me: a clever, strong, creative feminist who is miserable that she isn't thin.
I KNOW. It's almost worse when you're aware of how it all works because you feel like you should be able to keep yourself from feeling that way and yet you can't and it sometimes makes you feel guilty or just ridiculous. It's terrible.
Though right now my body is giving me a chance to break the cycle, because lately I just feel really shitty if I don't eat healthily. So the last six months, I've been losing weight in a way that's actually good for me.
That's great to hear.
When I think of myself, my body still looks like it did when I was in high school--very, very thin and with almost no curves. So then when I try on something that I think should 'look good' on me and it doesn't because my body has changed so much...it slams into me that I don't look that way anymore and that's when the frustration starts. The disconnect between how we look and how we think we look is so complicated and powerful.
I do appreciate you sharing your thoughts. I think one of the few ways to get better at this is talking about it.
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And there's this magical thinking -- if only I become thin, my life will be better. I buy into it despite knowing just how stupid it is. I guess some issues/beliefs are just older than the knowledge we have, and they're so deeply ingrained we can't get rid of them, just can't. I can look in a mirror and find something to appreciate, I really can. But it doesn't matter, because being fat is a state of perpetual vulnerability: people look at you and they can mock you, they can judge what you eat, they can side-eye you when you're out of breath. A fat girl is hilarious when she's trying to look hot. So maybe there's some sense in our magical belief that losing weight will make things better?
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I think like that too. It's making me roll my eyes at myself right now. I'm "average" weight for my height I guess you'd say, and I still look at myself and see mostly flaws. It's so hard to talk about, definitely...and yeah, definitely hard to be objective about... I guess my point is, -hugs- I too have Body Issues, and I'm here and I'm listening. Wish I could be more help. Or, more accurately, I wish our society didn't suck so much at this shit. -emphatic nod-
Also, hi,
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Thank you <333. Agreed, body issues are more in our heads than they're in our bodies. I was also "average" weight for my height when I was a teenager (I gained weight later, and now, objectively speaking, I should drop a size or two to reach healthy weight), but I was absolutely convinced I was fat. So, thank you, society. You suck.
Lauren's post caught me off-guard last night, because it was REALLY late and I was sleepy, so I just wrote out all my feelings about the issue. I was too tired to self-censor. You're right, usually it's a lot harder to talk about it. I'm kinda glad I was too sleepy to have a filter :).
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And what you're saying gives me so many feelings, but I just don't know how to talk about body issues at all. It's this weird mixture about being a bit too immersed in it, while also feeling terribly illegitimate about it (which tbf is the stupidest thing).
the difference between what we find aesthetically pleasing and what we enjoy tactically—about how pot bellies are lovely to touch but we act like they’re the opposite of sexy
Yeah this is so interesting and I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Especially in regards to sex and the perception and definition of desire.
I want to go back to having the sort of relationship with my body that was much more positive, but I’m not sure how to do all that.
Basically.
no subject
I have so many confused feelings about kpop fandom??? I have to admit, one thing I find really strange generally is how people like Sunggyu are considered to be unattractive solely because everyone around him is so conventionally “pretty”? And in other sections of fandom (and kpop culture generally) there seem to be really ridiculous standards for beauty that actually make me get why someone like Woohyun would be so fixated on maintaining his conventional ~hotness – because people will absolutely tear you apart otherwise. But then, this part of fandom with you and Eleonore and co. is A+ and all about appreciating everyone’s looks as they are, so really I feel lucky I know the right people.
That’s awesome to hear that you managed to escape toxic beauty standards from your family while growing up. Your mother sounds like a dream.
Anyway, I’m glad you made this post. YANA! And this kind of thing needs to be talked about among women way more often. /whomp whomp
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I also gain weight in my stomach only and it sucks. Just found a dress I like with a higher waistline but it is a bit fancy... I've been wearing it everywhere anyway since the simpler sundresses make me feel awful these days.
Re: the girls at the mall: I've so been there. It's a struggle. But a lot of those girls have ruined their hair by straightening it to death, so hey, at least you and I have nice curly hair :). Really though, I wish curly hair was more "in." Life would be easier. Developed World Problems, I know...
-Hugs- I've been thinking about you lately in thinking about my own social anxiety -- it's so good to know I'm not alone even if we are practically strangers on opposite sides of the country. None of my IRL friends have these issues so it's good to have a space to talk about them. Thanks.
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shut up I'm never late to anythingI sometimes have mornings where nothing I own looks good at all and I have the sudden and bizarrely irrational urge to wander about in a thong and sports bra and tell the world to fuck it.
Because I have a pear-shape. Huge butt (so huge I can't even), wide hips and thighs, flat(ish) stomach, no boobs, thick calves... 100 years ago I would have been all the rage. Today, the clothes seem to be made purposefully to make me feel stupid. Shopping can either be a nightmare or heaven and it just depends upon the day and who I'm with.
**hugs**
I agree with everything you have to say about this, love. ((Especially about Sunggyu's arms. My squishy husband.))
no subject
I feel as if I say anything it will just like, UNLEASH THE CRAKEN and I shall never stop. But yeah, I feel you. Body issues have always been a huge part of my life, and even coming to terms with the fact that I had body issues was a really influential experience in my life.
white (this mall is in a nicer area of town and there ARE people of color there, but not nearly as many and of course that’s hugely problematic), looong very straight hair, makeup but not ‘too much,’ femme but not really girly
Yeah. It's such a great thing for fashion diversity that people can shop online, but it ends up being one of those very stark disappearances of women who don't fit this particular femininity presentation. ie, you can only be in public if you are "presentable," but the way to do that is to go to the place where you acquire the tools to become "presentable!"
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It sounds like you grew up in an amazing family and are doing a great job just trying to live your life in this f'd up society. I feel like I had a pretty similar experience (well, except the for the skinny part - I'm average-weight as well, but I've always been awkwardly curvy, can rarely find clothes that fit well, and hate shopping.)
I am so lucky that I work in a field (ecology) where you can be a woman and wear jeans and t-shirt and no make-up every day and have no professional repercussions. In fact, the few times that I've worn "fancy" clothes (= not a t-shirt) to work, I ended up getting acid holes in them, so now I make it a policy not to.
no subject
I cant say I don't have body issue because I would be lying so freaking hard BUT something I took, & inserted in every little & big thing in my life, from music (well learning music) it was that I'm stronger, bigger & more capable than a piece of paper. I didn't let the hard music pieces defeat me, so I take the same approach with mass production clothing. I just try to find things that make the troublesome parts of my body look really good and alter the rest that is too big or too long. It was the only way for me to "win" against clothing & to took off the stress of my shoulders. I'm not exactly short in height but I have short limbs for most of the regular clothes but I have too much weight for the petite sizes and most of the time I'm not "big enough" for plus-size. Is a mess hahahahaha. I just prefer to alter the clothing to fit me the right way, it feels so much easier for me that way. Plus I hate being in a mall for hours.
I hope you can talk yourself into having the same positive image you had! You sound pretty awesome to me!!!!