*rolls eyes*

[lirazel]

OMG Y'ALL.

Did you know that we as Spuffy/Spike fans have ~superpowers???? That we can render things meaningless for other people? Also did you know that anyone who doesn't think the earlier seasons of BtVS are "better" is automatically "lacking in perspective" about the show?

Because I wasn't aware of this, but I'm so glad that people have informed and enlightened me! I can now fix my perspective to get it in line with....

Oh. Wait. Who decides these things again? They're opinion-based? You mean that no one is actually wrong if they enjoy a different episode of a TV show than I do? Seriously?

CHAOS WILL NOW ENSUE. HOW WILL THE UNIVERSE BEAR UP UNDER SUCH ANARCHY?

*runs and hides*

Comments

[shipperx.livejournal.com]

Did you know that we as Spuffy/Spike fans have ~superpowers???? That we can render things meaningless for other people?

Having been informed several years ago that Spuffies destroyed all of television (No joke. shapinglight even has an icon), I've known for a while that in certain quarters we are considered to have superpowers.

Unfortunately said superpowers never seemed to incorporate us getting anything we actually want, but our mere existence seems to be enough to be a constant agitant to some, so I suppose that's considered to super power enough. >:]

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

LOVE YOUR ICON.

Having been informed several years ago that Spuffies destroyed all of television

You don't happen to have a link, do you? I would love to read this.

So is this the "WE ARE BECOME SPUFFY, DESTROYER OF WORLDS" icon? Because that one never fails to make me laugh.

Unfortunately said superpowers never seemed to incorporate us getting anything we actually want, but our mere existence seems to be enough to be a constant agitant to some, so I suppose that's considered to super power enough. >:]

HAHAHA. I will never stop laughing at this.

[elisi]

No joke. [info]shapinglight even has an icon
This the one you're thinking of? frimfram made it back when that kerfuffle happened. *is proud Spuffy shipper*

My Icon is directed at the rude idiots not you!

[pfeifferpack.livejournal.com]

I think in many cases those who hold to the "first three seasons are all that really matter" are of the same mindset as those 40 year olds fondly looking back to their high school "glory years". I have learned to avoid most sites that are not clearly Spike or Spuffy friendly (at least). I get tired of the depth of the nastiness I find otherwise.

Kathleen
Superpowered! YAY I am now a Joss variety representative of girl power!!! What are my powers cause I wish to do violence?

I figured!

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

YES. I also think it's like deird1's Vegemite Effect: they're so used to it being one way that when things don't turn out the way they expect, they reject the idea that things might be different but still good. And I understand that--I fall into the same patterns of thinking sometimes. But it's so prevalent in Whedon fandom, and it drives me CRAZY.

I have zero problem with people liking the earlier seasons better, even though I don't. My problem is when people speak definitively about how the earlier seasons are better and everyone knows it and anyone who disagrees is WRONG WRONG WRONG and just blinded by the site of Rapist Spike's Abs of Hotness.

I think your powers are mostly just ruining BtVS for the "real" fans who watch the show in the "right" way. But maybe we could invest in some rocket launchers?

[treadingthedark.livejournal.com]

Funny. I just got done leaving an irritated post there which was much milder than what I was really feeling. I'm actually pretty pissed off. In an American way of course. Too early in the morning for English pissed.

But I digress. It really gets old being the butt monkey of fandom. We totally got shat on with Season 8, are so unimportant and minor that the powers that write shitty comics felt perfectly fine with the shitting, but yet somehow we have the power to subvert a favorite episodes list.
FUCK YOU STUPID OTHER FANS!
Ah. I feel better now. Thanks for letting me vent, feel free to delete this if you don't want the drama!

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Wait. What's your name over there? I never knew you were there!

I'm pretty pissed off, too, but last time I got snarky, I got chastised for it, despite the fact that the other person was being way more patronizing than I was. Whatever.

YES to your analysis of fandom politics.

No, no, feel free to vent. This is a vent-safe space!

[ruuger]

OMG I just realised why I like not only seasons 5-7 of Buffy, but the last two seasons of The X-Files and season 5 of Babylon 5, and prefer the post!Clooney years on ER! It's because of spuffy! And here I've always thought that I prefer later seasons because the cast is more comfortable and the characters have more history...

(when I saw your post I first thought that someone had finally posted a link to this at Whedonesque causing the Joss-can-do-no-bad brigade to crawl out of their lairs again)

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

SPUFFY DESTROYS EVERYTHING.

I loved your post over there, btw. Even if Simon swooped in to shut things down.

I do adore comfortable casts and characters having history....Hmmm...

(OMG. I wish someone would! And yet I don't, because it would turn ugly very quickly and everyone would FREAK THE HELL OUT and you and I and Emmie and whoever would have to start taking blood pressure medication. Otoh, there was some great discussion of that post over on ontd_feminism.)

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

Return of the douchebags!

Looks like the grapes are tasting sour...

Wow, how horrible that a lot of people still like Spike. Let's declare them all pseudofans!

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Not only are we WRONG WRONG WRONG, we also "hijaked" the poll! HEAVEN FORBID!

[elisi]

Buffy and Angel broke up nearly 11 years ago... (Graduation Day Pt.2 aired on the 13th of July 1999).

Just sayin'.

;)

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Wow. That was...a long time ago.

[redsilverchains.livejournal.com]

HI, WE ARE BOTH IN CAPSLOCK MOOD!

What that dude said...huh.

Early season lover here. S2-3 are very, very dear to me; I adore fuzzy!Willow and schoolboy!Xander; and highschool!Buffy is special to me.

But I watched S5-7 for ZOMG Buffy/Spike so according to him, I am rendering myself meaningless...?

*collapses in on herself*

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I totally understand the early!season!love, even if my heart belongs to the later seasons (OLDER!BUFFY FTW!).

YOU'RE MESSING UP THE TIME/SPACE CONTINUUM. STOP IT NOW!

Also, in case you couldn't tell, I LOVE CAPSLOCK!

[gillo]

Somehow, I knew this would descend to bickering before too long. The list is somewhat Spuffy. Possibly because there are still a lot of active Spuffy fans around (look at seasonal_spuffy if you want evidence) or a lot of people who wanted some of the funnier episodes for a weekend Buffython.

Idiots who use terms like "indefensible" about lists of favourite episodes really do need a spanking, though. And not in a fun way. ;-)

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I totally agree about the spanking.

Spike and Spuffy fandom is dynamic and seems to be bringing new people in all the time. Casual fans probably just want to watch the lighter episodes, as you say. Combine these two things, and the results don't shock me at all.

[next_to_normal]

But if it's all about Spike, then there are some bizarre inconsistencies... I mean, I realize Spuffy fans are incapable of rational thought, but you'd think we'd at least remember to include "Smashed." There's sexxing in it!

Spuffy-bashing aside (because that's par for the course), I have to admit, some of those comments make me cringe in a Josh Lyman "That's not being a fan, that's having a fetish" kind of way. Seriously? Ranking every single episode in order of preference? Thinking up characters' favorite episode list?

And they say the Spuffy fans are the crazy ones.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I KNOW, RIGHT? WHERE'S THE SEXXIN'?

:D

Haha! I'm now imagining Joss discovering TV fandom. *dies laughing*

[http://users.livejournal.com/_jems_/]

Oh god, not the "only the first three seasons are the real Buffy" crowd again. I will never understand that crowd. I enjoyed the first three seasons, but I never connected with the characters in the first three seasons. It wasn't until Buffy stops being that cheerleader/prom queen wannabe and grew up that I started identifying with her, that I started really loving her. And the funny thing is that even now, when I go back, I STILL don't connect with her. Because I just don't understand her. Even knowing all that's to come, I still find her high school issues trivial for the most part.

(I think season 1 is campy fun but pretty terrible overall and season 2 has some amazing episodes and a great arc, but I find season 3 is completely killed by Angel/Buffy. Buffy's emotional arc is TERRIBLE in that season, just because they can never seem to figure out what's going on between her and Angel. Meanwhile, I think season 4 is the best season for standalones, season 5 is the best season overall and season 6 has the best emotional arc for Buffy. So, you know, I'm obviously wrong.)

[treadingthedark.livejournal.com]

I enjoyed the first three seasons perfectly well. I would even say it was my favorite show. I dutifully taped it on my VCR, then watched it when I got around to it, then erased it.

By the end of the run I was a whole different kind of fan. I watched each episode in real time because I couldn't wait, plus the picture was better, and I watched each episode more than once. I was on line reading reviews and analysis, and seeking out more info and analysis. Since the show ended I have participated in one way or another in fandom on a nearly daily basis. I buy everything Spike related I can find. And even though I'm starting to scare myself with what I just wrote I guess I'm not a real fan either.

[eilowyn.livejournal.com]

I have a bad cold, I'm drugged out on medicine, I still feel metaphorically hung over from my big wedding weekend, and now the idiots are out in force, saying that my opinions are invalid because they fall in with the "hijacker" crowd.

Going back to bed.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Aw, hon! *hugs*

How was the crazy wedding?

Enjoy bedtime!

[madcap-shiny.livejournal.com]

Oy. You know, I'm just going to stand here with my pom-poms and be the B/A shippin' high-school-seasons-are-my-favorite fan that hella supports your Spuffy shippin' later-seasons-are-better self. BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT'S SO GREAT ABOUT OPINIONS, EH? You can respect them! And even be friends with people who have preferences that diverge from your own!

Oh, Whedonesque. Never change.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I KNOW I KNOW. We totally disagree but we love each other anyways! Why can't everyone be as awesome as us?

[likeserendipity.livejournal.com]

I WATCHED THAT MARATHON.

I LOVE LOGO. AND FY OMWF BEING #1. IT WASN'T YOU VOTING ON THE BEST EPISODES. IT WAS YOUR *FAVORITE* EPISODES.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

YAY!

I know nothing about Logo! But they have BtVS marathons, and that is awesome!

1. IT WASN'T YOU VOTING ON THE BEST EPISODES. IT WAS YOUR *FAVORITE* EPISODES.

THIS. Why do people not get this? My favorites list is very different than my "best" list. And that's okay!

I am glad you're back!

[anythingbutgrey.livejournal.com]

STOP GOING TO WHEDONESQUE IT'S BAD FOR YOU.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

SEE I READ YOUR WORDS AND RECOGNIZE THE WISDOM BUT I HAVE NO SELF-CONTROOOOOL.

[rebcake.livejournal.com]

Well, that's just ridiculous. EVERYBODY knows the even-numbered seasons are the best ones! Anybody who thinks the odd-numbered ones are in some way an improvement are out to lunch. I mean, there are MORE of the odd-numbered ones, sure, but that's no indication of quality! Sheesh. I feel like I'm talking to a wall here!

[local-max.livejournal.com]

No it's the seasons that leave a remainder 2 when divided by 3 that are the best (2, 5)! it's obvious!!1!

[snickfic]

You are a different person than me. I would abandoned these people to their own stupidity long ago.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

You are a wiser person than me. I seriously do not understand why I keep getting pulled back in. I should never have signed up for an account. When someone says something dumb on, say, BuffyForums, I move on, because I can't reply.

I wonder how one would go about deleting one's account....

[probablecylon.livejournal.com]

We are Spuffy hear us roar!!

I am concentrating right now on rendering all anti-Spuffies and whingers sterile merely by concentrating on Buffy administering invisi-latio to Spike in "Gone". It's unlikely to occur to the Buppies -- my new term for those who just know that the Buffypuppyluv years were the perfectest ever -- that the demographic might have a special fondness for that scene, I mean, uhm, ep ;) . . .

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Ha!

[local-max.livejournal.com]

Oops. I feel bad now--I said in my Whedonesque comment, "The extreme Spuffiness of the poll does make things seem a little skewed." I hope you know that I'm not dissing anyone! I was trying to communicate, "Wow, that list is Spuffier than mine would be!" (Though my list would have Dead Things in the top ten, which is very Spuffy.)

I also hope I counterbalanced this by spending a paragraph talking about how much I love that Gone was on the list, even though I think it's not a good episode, because it's awesome that there are people who love it.

ANYWAY. Any list that has The Wish and Doppelgangland at high places hasn't been taken over by Spuffies. DOWN WITH TEH HATERS!

(Also, I still can't get over how the author of the poll results article complained that "Innocense" wasn't on the list. USE A SPELL-CHECKER. THEY COME WITH WORD PROCESSORS.)

[local-max.livejournal.com]

OH RIGHT. And after finally getting to the point where I'm not annoyed at everything Hellmouthguy says, he goes and once again is a raging jerk:

"I don't know, Changeling, maybe it's just my tone when I post? Because nowhere in my posts did I say that my opinion is objective while everyone else's is subjective. Yes, I do tend not to bother adding "in my opinion" when I post, because it seems redundant, and I admit I can be rather blunt. But I don't begrudge anyone their opinion."

YES IT IS YOUR TONE WHEN YOU POST. ACCUSATIONS OF HIJACKING BY PEOPLE WHO LACK PERSPECTIVE MAY VERY POSSIBLY UPSET PEOPLE.

[infinitewhale.livejournal.com]

Also did you know that anyone who doesn't think the earlier seasons of BtVS are "better" is automatically "lacking in perspective" about the show?

Pfft. People say that all the time, but honestly, I've never seen anyone put forth an argument as to *why* they're supposedly better. All you get is: They just *are*, damn it! Bah. Easier to watch, perhaps, but to me, that's not better, it's more boring.

I ran away from common boards like whedonesque, c&s and twop back during S7 when posting anything positive about the show would be translated to "flame my ass" by the hive.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

You are so right. I have quite a few friends who like the earlier seasons better, but these friends are awesome and realize it's their opinion and don't try to convince me otherwise.

I really would like to read, like, side-by-side essays, one explaining why the earlier seasons are better, one arguing for the later seasons.

[prophecygirrl.livejournal.com]

I am Wile E.Coyote Spuffy, soooooper-genius.


Oh, Hell's Bells. Not again. I don't know how you stand it.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I don't, either.

*sigh*

[xlivvielockex.livejournal.com]

I'm here via a link on gabrielleabelle's LJ, hope that is okay.

When ATS was airing, apparently the C/Aers killed ATS. There were plenty of posts all over about it. C/Aers ruined the whole show! How dare they! As if we were all organized and marched on headquarters or something. I guess we had superpowerz then too.

So I totally feel for you. The saddest part is just today, I saw someone talking about how Cordelia ruined ATS by her mere presense and how this person couldn't believe C/A had any fans.

I am just still boggled that these kinds of comments still exist.

(And I love your mood theme. Jackie FTW! I think we should be LJ friends, if that is okay with you?)

[local-max.livejournal.com]

When ATS was airing, apparently the C/Aers killed ATS.

This type of thing angers me too! The show did C/A because Whedon, Greenwalt, DB and CC et al. wanted to do C/A. It's not like C/Aers tied the writing team up and made them write a romance against their will.

[ohwaluvusbab.livejournal.com]

I love this post and the comments herein. We are awesome.

And JMHO - I still struggle to connect with Buffy as a character in the early seasons too. And I was *15* when I started watching the show (so, about same age as S1 Buffy), and still I related far more with S5-7 Buffy. And I still do. But, you know, I am clearly a freakazoid

I also have never seen a logical analysis for why the early seasons are 'better' either. People usually put phrases like 'more enjoyable', 'stronger Scooby friendship', 'B/A 4-EVA' out there, and seem to forget that those are still *subjective opinions*. I could say that Buffy-the-character is more intellectually interesting in the later seasons because of the gender-bending and the fact she's more anti-hero than role model (and the sheer balls of TPTB to have their heroine *clinically depressed* for an entire season), but it still wouldn't give me the right to claim that the later seasons are objectively ~better. That kind of attitude just perpetuates intolerance. Why is that so hard for people to understand?

Is it July 4th yet?

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

We really are. And I love how I’ll post something silly about BtVS and all of a sudden it’s like HUNDREDS OF COMMENTS. And I’m always surprised! I never expect it!

You are so, so right. I’ve never seen an explanation, either. The explanation is always, “Everyone knows it is!” or “Spike took over the show!” WTF?

Almost!

[dragonflylady77.livejournal.com]

WE HAS SUPERPOWERS!! *SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEE*

I clicked on the link and read a bit and OMG I'm soooooooo glad I never ever EVER go on that site!

So much small-mindedness! So much Spike/Spuffy hate!!
I don't get how they can be so judgmental over a list asking people for their favourite episodes. It's so totally subjective!! *doesn't get it*

My 6yo daughter is a Spuffy shipper. Just like her mum. *nods*

&hearts