Amazing how a day can so totally turn around. One minute we're talking domestic Spuffy, the next...

[lirazel]

Dear Joss Whedon, Scott Allie, et. al.,

If you break Emmie's heart, I will never, ever, ever, ever, ever forgive you. Not in a million years. :P

No love,

Me

P.S. Jane? Please come back! We need you! If anyone can open these guys' eyes to their own privilege, it's you! These guys need a HBIC, and I nominate you.

Comments

[anythingbutgrey.livejournal.com]

WHAT IS THIS ABOUT?

ALSO I LOVE JANE ESPENSON I LOVE HOW MUCH SHE LOVES TO DISMANTLE PRIVILEGE I LOVE HOW MUCH SHE LOVES GAY STUFF I LOVE HOW SHE IS SO FUCKING AWESOME.

i don't like how she's running caprica and i'm still bored.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Emmie is my favorite person ever, and she is sad. Also, earlier today she and I were having a conversation about why we loved Buffy with Spike because of how feminist it is. Which you would have gotten a kick out of. Whenever I have a feminism discussion I think of you.

JANE ESPENSON IS MADE OF WIN IN EVERY SINGLE WAY CONCEIVABLE.

Except that Caprica is no good.

[deird1]

Also, earlier today she and I were having a conversation about why we loved Buffy with Spike because of how feminist it is.

Link?

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Uh, it was a very brief conversation. We didn't go into depth, and it was mostly Emmie writing and then me frantically agreeing, but I think we should tag-team a meta on it! It'd be awesome!

Here it is!

[anythingbutgrey.livejournal.com]

hahaha i do love when people associate me with feminism. as everyone i know tends to do? idk i love my life. how is buffy/spike feministy, though? i... have never been on this boat. EXPLICA POR FAVOR danke.

so sad about caprica. so pretty, so well written, so poorly plotted.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

I definitely associate you with it! It makes me happy! You're like my feminist lj soulmate!

Short answer: because she's in control, and he follows her lead. The whole relationship is one giant inversion of stereotypical gender roles (which I kind of wrote a paper about once). But I posted the link to the brief discussion a few comments [down -- edit: er, up!], if you want to follow it.

It IS so pretty! As is evidenced by your gorgeous, gorgeous icon!

And it makes me think Jane needs to be able to create her own show. No more of this writing for shows created by men. GIVE HER HER OWN.

[anythingbutgrey.livejournal.com]

YAY! :D

interesting. i see that link, i understand though i don't think i can agree. my brain still goes RAPE ABUSE KIDNAP FLAIL but that's why... i am not a spuffy shipper even though i have this icon and love that whole ~when i say i love you it's not because i want you or because i can't have you~ speech that i TOTALLY HAVE MEMORIZED A+ WILLIAM i c ur poetry thar.


also yyyy jane needs her own show involving fierce women, lesbians, feminist men, and possibly space. i do like pretty people in space. that worked well for her.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Well, let it be said that I mostly ship them either A) when he has a soul YAY S7! or B) based on potential in S5. I love what they did with the relationship in S6 (except for the AR, which was poorly executed; it could have been handled much better), but I don't ship them then. Neither one of them were in a position to have a healthy relationship at that point, and they certainly weren't healthy.

But. In S6, she was still in control the vast majority of the time. So even when she was weak, when she was making bad decisions, etc. she was still in control of her own destiny (except for "Seeing Red"). That's what makes me most upset about Angel--he constantly tries to make decisions for her and is SO DAMN PATRONIZING. Anyway, in my paper, I wrote about Buffy and Spike as a Foucauldian binary with Buffy on top and Spike trying to displace her, but he only--almost--manages in "Seeing Red," which is about him trying to assert his "masculinity" after an entire show wherein he plays the female role--and it backfires. Big time. Him trying to embrace a stereotypically masculine role is damaging and hurtful. (I was actually going to write my paper about Buffy having one foot in the feminine and one foot in the masculine and that when she gets out of balance things are bad, but I got sidetracked. I'd still like to write that.) But the binary settles again with Buffy on top in S7, and she stays there.

Throughout S7, Spike plays the damsel role, Buffy's the knight, protecting and saving him. It's fascinating stuff. They're constantly undermining gender assumptions AND I LOVE IT.

Also, I had a conversation yesterday about how Spike is the housewife in any future relationship they have. Hee!

My enjoyment of both S6 and their relationship in general is very specific to me. I don't at all think that any of my conclusions were intended by the writers, but the author's dead, right? And I can see how people would arrive at other conclusions. But it just hits a ton of my feminist kinks. rahirah always says that they're the best queer couple she ever saw on TV--she never connected to Willow/Tara as a lesbian, but she connected to the metaphor for being in the closet that's prevelant all through the Buffy/Spike relationship.

ANYWAY. I've rambled enough about this! So I'll say that your icon is so very pretty and:

i TOTALLY HAVE MEMORIZED A+ WILLIAM i c ur poetry thar.
LOVE. IT.

[eta] YES! ALL OF THAT IN SPACE. YES YES YES. That would be my TV soulmate.