Basically, if we sat around and waited for something perfect to invest in—something that wasn’t problematic, something in which every oppressed group was treated perfectly, something that didn’t have any content that could hurt a viewer—we would never be able to invest in anything. We wouldn’t even have fandom. We wouldn’t be able to tell stories.
Yes. YES. Yes to this entire post, and especially this part. Everything is problematic on some level, and when people try to deny that and play the "my thing I love is totally less problematic than your thing you love" game, it sucks.
This is something I've been thinking about for a while, and I think you've really identified to two main axis against which people judge whether or not they are willing to put up with the problems in a certain story: A) How much they like the other elements of the story, and B) how bothered they are by the problematic bits (which will be influenced by a combination of personal experience, personal preference, etc).
And the thing is, these will be REALLY different for different people. And that's fine. But when people start saying "well my thing is objectively better than your thing," when what they really mean is "my thing has other story elements that appeal to me more, and/or it's most problematic in areas that ping me less" the atmosphere becomes corrosive.
I think a significant part of the problem, as you say, is a lack of empathy. If Person A has absolutely zero interest in American folklore or stories that play with religious elements, and aren't willing to think about the fact that other people DO love those elements as much as A loves star crossed lovers (or whatever it is they love), then yeah, they're going to look at Supernatural and be all "why would you EVER watch that, it's so bad to its female characters." But... we're all fans. How hard is it to emphasize with the feelings of fannishness, even if you don't like it? Like you, I have no interest in Angel's brand of man!pain, but I'm willing to believe that for some people, his brooding attempts at finding personal salvation are as interesting as Spike's redemption arc is to me. I don't GET it, but I'm not going to hate on them for being more forgiving of Angel's flaws than I am because of it.
So basically, a-fucking-men. Why can't we all just get along?
no subject
Yes. YES. Yes to this entire post, and especially this part. Everything is problematic on some level, and when people try to deny that and play the "my thing I love is totally less problematic than your thing you love" game, it sucks.
This is something I've been thinking about for a while, and I think you've really identified to two main axis against which people judge whether or not they are willing to put up with the problems in a certain story: A) How much they like the other elements of the story, and B) how bothered they are by the problematic bits (which will be influenced by a combination of personal experience, personal preference, etc).
And the thing is, these will be REALLY different for different people. And that's fine. But when people start saying "well my thing is objectively better than your thing," when what they really mean is "my thing has other story elements that appeal to me more, and/or it's most problematic in areas that ping me less" the atmosphere becomes corrosive.
I think a significant part of the problem, as you say, is a lack of empathy. If Person A has absolutely zero interest in American folklore or stories that play with religious elements, and aren't willing to think about the fact that other people DO love those elements as much as A loves star crossed lovers (or whatever it is they love), then yeah, they're going to look at Supernatural and be all "why would you EVER watch that, it's so bad to its female characters." But... we're all fans. How hard is it to emphasize with the feelings of fannishness, even if you don't like it? Like you, I have no interest in Angel's brand of man!pain, but I'm willing to believe that for some people, his brooding attempts at finding personal salvation are as interesting as Spike's redemption arc is to me. I don't GET it, but I'm not going to hate on them for being more forgiving of Angel's flaws than I am because of it.
So basically, a-fucking-men. Why can't we all just get along?